I understand that we all have different ways of representing and encoding information and my question relates primarily to long-term memory. When I study I generally try to get the ‘gist’ of the information before I move on, this has been useful to me in passing examinations recently and having a relatively high score rate on essays but as time passes much of what I have learnt tends to fade. I ask this question because I know a man who has an astonishing memory and can recount quite abstruse historical facts on demand at 86-years old. Without information actually ‘sticking’ I ask myself what’s the bloody point of doing these exams and essays, they literally become meaningless bits of paper.

A while back I went to see an NLP practitioner about an unrelated issue and after a short talk he gave me a piece of paper with the letters ‘KVA’ written on it. He explained that this was my preferred order of representation. I have read that for more technical subjects such as chemistry a strong visual capacity is required. I am quite weak in science and mathematics.

Is it possible to actively cultivate learning strategies that contradict the ‘natural’ order of things being dominantly kinaesthetic? And more importantly what is the best way to go about this?

Many thanks

Hi Mario

You are totally correct because we all do have different ways of representing and encoding informations within ourselves. If you ask yourself "what's the bloody point of doing these exams and essays" then, yes, much of what you have learned as time passes might tend to fade until you ask yourself something else.

KVA is an acronim for 'kilo volt amps' which is electicity watts and means you have a high potential to cast light and although that's not from nlp, it is probably more relevant and means you get to choose your own prefered order of representation. Regardless of what you have read, you will be strong in science, mathematics or any other subject once you have found your motivating reasons for your desired interest in whatever you do, then it will be very easy.

Quote: "Is it possible to actively cultivate learning strategies that contradict the ‘natural’ order of things being dominantly kinaesthetic?"
Yes, it is possible.

Close your eyes and watch yourself doing the things, you think, you do kinestetically. Start to be conscious of what you are already visualizing because you already do it and practice will help you to be more conscious of it and as you turn on the lights it will become totally clear.

James

Mario_Basler wrote:

Without information actually ‘sticking’ I ask myself what’s the bloody point of doing these exams and essays, they literally become meaningless bits of paper.

Your question about the use of preferred representational systems in strategies for learning is a good one. I expect other folks in the group will address your question directly, so I'd like to make a suggestion that's perhaps a bit tangential but still (hopefully) useful.

You might want to check out a software program called "SuperMemo." It's a flashcard program that uses a spaced repetition algorithm to enable you to learn any kind of material and retain it pretty much forever. I've been using the program since May of 2008 to learn French vocabulary, and the program calculates that I'm currently maintaining a 92.55% retention rate.

If you're interested, you can purhcase the program for $19.95 as an instant download from the following web site: Super Memory

Hope that helps.

Cheers,
Aaron Spurling

Mario_Basler wrote:

my question relates primarily to long-term memory.

Long-term memory gets its information from short-term memory. To move it from short-term to long-term requires that the information be made "significant", usually either by repetition or by some emotional involvement.

I know a man who has an astonishing memory and can recount quite abstruse historical facts on demand at 86-years old.

I know people like this. They tend to do it visually.

Without information actually ‘sticking’ I ask myself what’s the bloody point of doing these exams and essays, they literally become meaningless bits of paper.

Getting a degree, I would think, is the bloody point, is it not?

A while back I went to see an NLP practitioner about an unrelated issue and after a short talk he gave me a piece of paper with the letters ‘KVA’ written on it.

You can throw that away. It meant little then, and nothing now.

He explained that this was my preferred order of representation.

Assuming he was accurate, it was your preferred order of representation at that time in your life, in that context, doing what you were doing. It says nothing about you now, or in any other context, or doing anything else.

I have read that for more technical subjects such as chemistry a strong visual capacity is required. I am quite weak in science and mathematics.

Those I've met who were strong in those fields tended to be strong visualizers.

Is it possible to actively cultivate learning strategies that contradict the ‘natural’ order of things being dominantly kinaesthetic? And more importantly what is the best way to go about this?

You are probably not "dominantly kinaesthetic". It may be true that you prefer to get physically involved with learning, though. If that's the case, get some colored modeling clay and some sticks and build models of molecules; this will help you to see them.

I'd be interested in when you have learned easily, and how you did that.

Suggestable wrote:

KVA is an acronim for 'kilo volt amps' which is electicity watts and means you have a high potential to cast light

Very cool.

Mario_Basler wrote:

I understand that we all have different ways of representing and encoding information ...

I'm not sure what you mean here.

The neo-cortex is sort of divided (i.e. non-exclusively) into specialist areas - motor cortex, visual cortex, olfactory bulb, etc. Last time I checked the best guess was that information stored in long-term memory is first divided into its sensory constituents and then stored. To recall something the relevant information has to be reconstituted.

So forget the idea that learning is best done in one mode or another. They're ALL involved.

Mario_Basler wrote:

... and my question relates primarily to long-term memory. When I study I generally try to get the ‘gist’ of the information before I move on, this has been useful to me in passing examinations recently and having a relatively high score rate on essays but as time passes much of what I have learnt tends to fade.

This is basically a good idea. But are you using repetition and 'refreshers', for example?

"The common Cormorant or Shag,
Lay's it's eggs in baper bags.
The reason, as you know, no doubt,
Is thus to keep the lightning out.
But what these unobservant birds
Have failed to notice is that herds
Of wandering bears may come, with buns,
And steal the bags to hold the crumbs."

or this slightly less logical offering:

"Deck the halls with Boston Charlie -
Wallah, wallah, wash and kallamazoo
Nora's freezing on the trolley -
Swalladollarcauliflower alleygaroo

Don't we know archaic barrel
Lullaby, lily boy, loiusevill lou.
Trolley Molly don't love Harold.
Boollah, boollah, pensicola hullabaloo."

I taught myself these two poems over 20 years ago, for my own amusement, by reading and repeating them at least once a day until they stuck. I repeat them to myself about once every three months, even if I've said either of them out loud to someone in the meantime. FWIW I think this is the first time I've seen either poem written down since I learnt them.

Now this isn't NLP, but the I've found the technique very useful:

1. WANT to learn whatever you have to learn. Your current attitude of asking why it's worth it is very self-limiting and creates strong resistance to effective learning.

And in any case, there's a perfectly good answer - you are learning to learn and retain information. You may not care much about the information you are currently learning, but if you learn to learn well then you will have obtained a skill that will last all your life.

2. Using poetry as a medium for learning information (a) makes it easier to take in, and equally importantly, (b) gives you a way of checking your memory. Try saying either poem a couple of times, out loud, so you get a feel for the rhythm, and then say it but leave out a word or phrase here and there. Notice how obvious it is that you've left something out.

3. The first poem is complete. The second, which can be sung to the tune of "Deck the halls with boughs of holly", is only the first couple of verses.

Both of them are of a length I found I personally could memorise quite easily. Other people might prefer to divide information into larger or smaller chunks.

Mario_Basler wrote:

I ask this question because I know a man who has an astonishing memory and can recount quite abstruse historical facts on demand at 86-years old.

Have you asked him how he learnt the stuff in the first place, and how he keeps it fresh?

Mario_Basler wrote:

Without information actually ‘sticking’ I ask myself what’s the bloody point of doing these exams and essays, they literally become meaningless bits of paper.

Or, they represent exercises that helped you to learn a valuable skill.

Mario_Basler wrote:

A while back I went to see an NLP practitioner about an unrelated issue and after a short talk he gave me a piece of paper with the letters ‘KVA’ written on it. He explained that this was my preferred order of representation.

And maybe he was entirely correct - at that time and in that context. However, that doesn't necessarily mean that you will ever use that same order in any other context or at any other time.

Mario_Basler wrote:

I have read that for more technical subjects such as chemistry a strong visual capacity is required. I am quite weak in science and mathematics.

Again, it depends. German chemist August Kekule allegedly discovered the structure of the 'benzene ring' after having a dream in which he saw a snake biting its own tail.

But even if it's true, would it have been any less effective a dream if instead of seeing something he had heard a voice declaiming: "Remember Ouroboros"?

Mario_Basler wrote:

Is it possible to actively cultivate learning strategies that contradict the ‘natural’ order of things being dominantly kinaesthetic? And more importantly what is the best way to go about this?

Since the particular "natural order" you refer to doesn't exist it is easy to learn various strategies to improve your learning.

Personally I'd recommend that you read up on the NLP strategies for getting yourself into the right "state" for learning; and start with Tony Buzan's mind maps as a way of helping you to actually store and recall information in what seems to be a genuinely "natural" manner.

Be well

Andy B.