james_t wrote:

This from the guy who makes four posts in a row that have nothing to do with the subject of the thread, but are all about one-upping another poster?

Maybe it's just my sense of humour, but I find that fucking hysterical

I'm just curious as to who I tried to persuade that I'm smarter, more powerful, and have got more notches. I've been going through every post that I've made and I just don't see where I've been bragging.

James, please don't rip me too badly....

@James:

Then you must be easily amused.

Try to be more objective, I have responded to personal attacks from some sad loser from the 'seduction community' who simply doesn't like the fact that he is so transparent.

I have remained calm and rational, I have not resorted to personal abuse. And I have not resorted to foul-mouthed opinion. Exchanges take two people. For every response there was an original post. if you don't like it, stop reading because nobody really cares what you think unless you can be more articulate. In particular *I* don't care what you think and I cannot imagine anyone with any kind of professionalism resorting to the use of that kind of language in a forum of supposedly professional people.

You should feel embarrassed and ashamed of yourself but with Tony West, you have evidently found a kindred (if similarly uneducated) spirit so I suppose you feel perfectly comfortable in the company you keep.

D

mikmal wrote:

Yes, Daniel, age matters! It may not matter to those who say it doesn't matter, and it obviously does matter to you!

...

Narrow your horizons to the confines of your low self-esteem, and you risk closing doors of opportunity. Connect and communicate with wonderful people of any age and to create friendships that, for many reasons, can last through all the seasons of a long life.

Grow up / grow down and go well!

A good response Michael, and refreshing for its lack of personal attack and foul language on this topic. It seems the 'seduction community' consists mainly of ill-educated louts and those who apologise for them. Your response was gentlemanly and civil - and welcome for that.

D

Kirkers wrote:

David

Can you help me out here?

Is that everybody who ever has and everybody who ever will learn seduction techniques or is that just what it means to you and you have therefore, generalised your meaning?

I'm not saying that I agree or disagree with the specific learnings or teachings on this subject, I do not have the experience to do so. Just interested to understand your specific meaning.

Be happy

Sinéad

Sinead, hi.

Thanks for a civil and well-phrased question, and forgive me if I respond with what appears to be an unsympathetic opinion in respect of these people

I do not confuse the way things are with the way I believe they ought to be in a perfect world. Neither do I support or play devil's advocate on behalf of unacceptable. predatory and loutish behaviour.

Thus, it is my opinion from having brushed up against a few of these people, that they are mainly low-life people with some (sometimes a multitude of) issues. Pretty much as Tony has kindly illustrated about himself.

I suppose I ought to be more malleable and forgiving and warm and caring about these people but I am not. They are most often only interested in manipulating women into having sex with them, and they will lie cheat and manipulate in order to achieve their ends. They also have sophisticated bragging mechanisms and regularly compare techniques, the two reasons why they like to form their little 'communities'. Most of them appear to be damaged in some way. NLP is just another tool for them to use and Ross Jeffreys is their hero.

This is not just my opinion. Check the internet for these losers. Check the 'Pick up club' - the amount of material available on the 'pick-up artist' is huge and as professionals we should lament the way these people sometimes use the tools designed to be used in therapy to get a quick and cheap lay. Instead we get the apologists lining up to reveal their own intellectual shortcomings and defend the indefensible, principally on the basis that they feel sorry for the poor damaged and unwell lout that is making the personal attacks.

As it happens, in my career I have had to deal with a number of the vulnerable and sometimes broken young women who have been exploited by these 'seduction community' maggots, and it is this which is fuelling my resentment at their self-righteous protestations that they are doing nothing wrong. They say it is all perfectly innocent, that only consenting adults are involved, and that (after all) NLP is only an extension of their inner attractiveness and fine qualities. This is simply deception and they know very well none of these is the case, but it is the way they would like to be seen, and it is therefore the way they project themselves. These people are often pernicious and acting out a damaged need for revenge. They are losers who have developed manipulative skills and techniques in order to become the worst kind of predators - if that is a generalisation then so be it.

One such case concerned a 14-year-old girl who was besotted by a predatory 18-year old 'NLP'er' who used one of the 'Dark-Side' obsession-generating techniques on her. These people (or at least all of them I have ever heard about or come into contact with) have no conscience (or just no sense of the consequences of what they do), no regrets and they routinely share and brag about their exploits, in just the same way that Tony West does. And completely unlike what he says he does.

And then you get the idiots standing up for them. James is the latest but before then we had Adrian piling into me for saying things he disagrees with. Forgive me if I have similarly run out of patience with these people, but then I always did find voluntary stupidity offensive.

Apologies for an ill-tempered response to your very civil question, I have just had to sweep up after these disgusting 'seduction community' people too often so perhaps I have come to generalise - reasonably and based on solid experience.

D

9Steps wrote:

@James:

Then you must be easily amused.

As a matter of fact, I am. It's a tremendously enjoyable way to live!

Cheers,

James T

9Steps wrote:

Sinead, hi.

Thanks for a civil and well-phrased question, and forgive me if I respond with what appears to be an unsympathetic opinion in respect of these people

I do not confuse the way things are with the way I believe they ought to be in a perfect world. Neither do I support or play devil's advocate on behalf of unacceptable. predatory and loutish behaviour.

David the way that you have phrased this leads me to believe that you have personal issues and usually putdowns of others reflect inadequacies in ourselves. This is the usual cry of someone who thinks he is morally better than others and looks down on people, as you go to great lengths to tell us how much of a good therapist you are by "rescuing" poor and distressed women this is not a very theraputic attitude is it? Where is your unconditional positive regard and empathy?

9Steps wrote:

Thus, it is my opinion from having brushed up against a few of these people, that they are mainly low-life people with some (sometimes a multitude of) issues. Pretty much as Tony has kindly illustrated about himself.

Making personal snipes at others does not illustrate what you are attempting to hold, the higher moral ground. Many Many psychotherapists are still of the opinion that NLP in manipulative so if you are an exponent of NLP, as you seem to intimate, does that make you a manipulative therapist? and in the same light how can you be any better than the rest of us?

9Steps wrote:

I suppose I ought to be more malleable and forgiving and warm and caring about these people but I am not. They are most often only interested in manipulating women into having sex with them, and they will lie cheat and manipulate in order to achieve their ends. They also have sophisticated bragging mechanisms and regularly compare techniques, the two reasons why they like to form their little 'communities'. Most of them appear to be damaged in some way. NLP is just another tool for them to use and Ross Jeffreys is their hero.

Hmmm me thinks that the gentleman doth protest too much!!

Ross Jeffires or Paul Ross to his close friends has done a lot for both NLP and also the Seduction Community, which if you had not guessed I am an active member of... So in your eyes I am a maggot, so be it. I guess that you also look down on the likes of Richard Bandler, John La Valle, Kenrick Cleveland etc all of who have in some way either extolled the virtues of Ross Jeffries or actually co-trained with him. If you knew anything more than just his name, which it is apparent you definitely do not, you would know he has a very well defined code that he teaches to all of his students...

9Steps wrote:

This is not just my opinion. Check the internet for these losers. Check the 'Pick up club' - the amount of material available on the 'pick-up artist' is huge and as professionals we should lament the way these people sometimes use the tools designed to be used in therapy to get a quick and cheap lay. Instead we get the apologists lining up to reveal their own intellectual shortcomings and defend the indefensible, principally on the basis that they feel sorry for the poor damaged and unwell lout that is making the personal attacks.

As it happens, in my career I have had to deal with a number of the vulnerable and sometimes broken young women who have been exploited by these 'seduction community' maggots, and it is this which is fuelling my resentment at their self-righteous protestations that they are doing nothing wrong. They say it is all perfectly innocent, that only consenting adults are involved, and that (after all) NLP is only an extension of their inner attractiveness and fine qualities. This is simply deception and they know very well none of these is the case, but it is the way they would like to be seen, and it is therefore the way they project themselves. These people are often pernicious and acting out a damaged need for revenge. They are losers who have developed manipulative skills and techniques in order to become the worst kind of predators - if that is a generalisation then so be it.

One such case concerned a 14-year-old girl who was besotted by a predatory 18-year old 'NLP'er' who used one of the 'Dark-Side' obsession-generating techniques on her. These people (or at least all of them I have ever heard about or come into contact with) have no conscience (or just no sense of the consequences of what they do), no regrets and they routinely share and brag about their exploits, in just the same way that Tony West does. And completely unlike what he says he does.

And then you get the idiots standing up for them. James is the latest but before then we had Adrian piling into me for saying things he disagrees with. Forgive me if I have similarly run out of patience with these people, but then I always did find voluntary stupidity offensive.

Apologies for an ill-tempered response to your very civil question, I have just had to sweep up after these disgusting 'seduction community' people too often so perhaps I have come to generalise - reasonably and based on solid experience.

D

And because if the "alledged" horrible of experiences of your clients, which we on this forum have no way of verifying, you then tar us all with the same brush? I think that he who is without sin can cast the first stone! Don't you reside in Thailand the country where a 1000 bhat will buy you a woman for an evening and western paedophiles go for cheap and young tricks? as is my experience. Now if I were to take taking your slant on tarring everyone with the same brush could I not now class you as a pervert ot paedophile?

I apologise for the rant but I know Tony personally and he is a very valued friend of mine, I can vouch for his honesty and integrity. Yeah like everyone he gets rubbed up the wrong way and he may be experiencing interesting times but don't judge someone until you have walked in their shoes for a mile.

David I am really dissapointed with you. I have read a number of your other posts and they are insightful and informative this one just lets you down as a person. You have had your publicity and you are excellent at demonstrating your own beliefs and limitations, which in my carreer and experience it about all most psychologists are good at. This thread is not the David "9 Steps" Brook show it was a reasonable question from a teenager who wanted a bit more confidence in approaching women and it has now become your personal crusade and publicity machine. Again not a very theraputic or client centred approach as this seems to be all about you and your frame of reference. You probably did more harm to Daniel than good by continuing an arguement long after it should have been quashed.

Kindly shut up Jason, the damage to your credibility was done a while back as far as I am concerned, you don't appear to have anything to say - certainly nothing of interest to me.

If you have nothing sensible to say then best not say anything.

If you are a friend of Tony then you should have more discrimination.

If your experience of Thailand is 300bt whores and ladyboys then I am not surprised in the least, we all gravitate to the company we find most conducive, which is why my experience is with academics and clinicians and your is what it evidently is.

And I don't give a toss if you believe my clinical record, think I am a psychologist or are disappointed in me. The opinion of people like you is a matter of complete indifference to me, as it doubtless is to anyone who has an ounce of integrity or professionalism.

Wake up and get a life. A proper one.

David,

Your response to James tells me even more about you than your other words.

Still I suppose you help keep the boards busy.

Daniel, I don't know if you have gained anything because of or despite this diatribe, but I wish you well.

I have learned some interesting things about some people who may even be interesting, which I find quite interesting.

Now I will hie me hence to a road that is, sadly, I think, less travelled.

So, warriors and watchers, I wish you, at the very least, the best of what you wish yourself!

Go well

southnick wrote:

David,

Your response to James tells me even more about you than your other words.

Still I suppose you help keep the boards busy.

Yes, I suppose that is true. Words always tell a story, whether we are listening or not is altogether a different matter as I am sure you will agree.

Mindless insults tend to annoy me - but I suppose you missed them - right? Life is always much more convenient when you can pick and choose the reality you live in.

I have heard that if you have cockroaches, the worst thing you can do is step on one. The others appear to be aware of the demise of one of their own and all come crowding around. Of course I am not an entomologist and I only understand the human mind so I am naturally at a disadvantage where insects are concerned. Have you heard that about cockroaches?

I suppose I really ought to be concerned at your opinion.

Have a good day,

D

9Steps wrote:

Kindly shut up James, the damage to your credibility was done a while back as far as I am concerned, you don't appear to have anything to say - certainly nothing of interest to me.

If you have nothing sensible to say then best not say anything.

If you are a friend of Tony then yuou should have more discrimination.

If your experience of Thailand is 300bt whores and ladyboys then I am not surprised in the least, we all gravitate to the company we find most conducive, which is why my experience is with academics and clinicians and your is what it evidently is.

And I don't give a toss if you believe my clinical record, think I am a psychologist or are disappointed in me. The opinion of people like you is a matter of complete indifference to me, as it doubtless is to anyone who has an ounce of integrity or professionalism.

Wake up and get a life. A proper one.

David I love you please do not change and please keep posting....

Like Daniel, I am "starting out" with NLP. I dont know whether or not Daniel will post again but for myself...on this website I have received some incredible advice but the more I read these fight threads the more unlikely I am to post. Perhaps someone will shout me down, or perhaps be nasty? Some of the talk on this thread has been.
It's a real shame.

Hey Jasmin,

Please keep posting we need new view points and even though we disagree just like kids in the school ground there will be times we will agree. There are a number of people I disagree with and then they post something that I think is exquisite and I find myself agreeing with them.

that is what I use the thumbs for......

Jasmin wrote:

Like Daniel, I am "starting out" with NLP. I dont know whether or not Daniel will post again but for myself...on this website I have received some incredible advice but the more I read these fight threads the more unlikely I am to post. Perhaps someone will shout me down, or perhaps be nasty? Some of the talk on this thread has been.
It's a real shame.

Jasmin

Like yourself I have found some of the reading on this thread difficult and I would agree with your observation that there is a lot of 'shouting down' and some 'nastiness'.

However, as you've said NLPC is a place where some incredible advice can be sought and for me at least, it can be really entertaining. Some threads go a little crazy (as has this one) and its original purpose has been lost (huge apologies to Daniel), however, I'm hoping you can weigh this up with the many threads that are informative and helpful before perhaps making a decision not to post again. For what its worth, I learnt quite a bit from this thread


Be happy

Sinéad

danieljamie wrote:

Hey, Im new to the forum, I have read through "The Game" and "Mystery Method" and a few more articles to do with NLP and things, and I saw a few vids on youtube which amazed me if I'm honest.

But my question is, does age matter?

I am 18 years old, and think if I walked up to another 17 or 18 year old and did these pick up techniques and NLP, they would probably laugh in my face for even talking to them when I dont know them.

I could be totally wrong, so do correct me please.

Thanks, Daniel

Daniels original post.....

In all likelihood I'll probably regret this later, but right now I have some time to kill, so what the hell.

9Steps wrote:

Kindly shut up James, the damage to your credibility was done a while back as far as I am concerned, you don't appear to have anything to say - certainly nothing of interest to me.

Hate to break it to you buddy, but posting things that are "of interest to David" is not a requirement for participating in this forum. And as for credibility and "as far as I am concerned," well - as far as I am concerned - you have yet to actually establish any credibility here at all. And you're really not doing yourself any favours so far.

Fortunately for you, neither of our opinions on such matters amount to a hill of beans when it comes to who is and is not free to post here. Yay for freedom of expression! We both get to play in this lovely sandpit, because neither of us owns it - and the guy who does is a really nice and accommodating kind of chap.

9Steps wrote:

If you are a friend of Tony then you should have more discrimination.

Actually, Tony and I aren't friends at all. And I'm not a part of the PUA community. Nor am I a supporter of seduction as an application of NLP.

9Steps wrote:

If your experience of Thailand is 300bt whores and ladyboys then I am not surprised in the least, we all gravitate to the company we find most conducive, which is why my experience is with academics and clinicians and your is what it evidently is.

Never been to Thailand myself.

My experience is evidently what, by the way? I'm genuinely curious to know what you believe is evident about my experience.

9Steps wrote:

The opinion of people like you is a matter of complete indifference to me

People like me? And what kind of of person is that, exactly?

You seem to believe you know an awful lot about people based on very little information. Have you ever considered the possibility that your knee-jerk judgements of people might not be as accurate as you imagine?

Just a thought.


Cheers,

James T


PS. I'm curious as to whether you'll now imply (or state explicitly) that I'm foolish, uneducated, stupid, unprofessional or lacking in integrity - or whether it will be some combination of those. Seems that these are de facto the case whenever someone doesn't play along to your tune.

James,

I think that he (David) got you and me confused and the reply was for me. I am not as good looking as you so I take it as a compliment that David got us confused..

Jason

Hey you're right - I see he's edited the post so that it's addressed to you. Pffft. Spoil all my fun then!

aikijason wrote:

James,

I think that he (David) got you and me confused and the reply was for me. I am not as good looking as you so I take it as a compliment that David got us confused..

Jason

Indeed he did. He also finds it difficult to distinguish between crows and blackbirds, and between some fungi.

So on this occasion he confused the fungi.

The exhortation directed towards James should have been to stop being a foul-mouthed twit. You may both be twits but at least Jason has not noticeably been a foul-mouthed twit.

Seedy perhaps but not foul-mouthed.

And I don't really care if you have a good day or if your penis drops off.

D

LOL. I'm stuck deciding whether to use the ignore function or continue to be increasingly amused by the content of this thread!