I was browsing through old messages when i came across someone who was working with military personnel with PTSD. I now can't find that connection but am very interested in how that followed through. I have a client who has been told by her medical team that she has PTSD following the abuse she suffered from her ex-partner. I would welcome any advise from anybody who has any experience in this. (I thought closed eye procedures might not be a good idea). Also, what might be an added complication is that this lady still has some contact with her ex-partner because they have a daughter.
Thanx.
judy

Judy,

I have just returned from a one day workshop for "Stress, PSTD and Hypnotherapy" run by two medical doctors Medical Hypnotherapy - Home I have posted a review in that section.

They use EMDR in order to treat this with some good results.

I hope this helps? Feel free to PM me for further info.

Kind regards,

Nick

Judy, a psychologist has been using NLP for PTSD in the USA for awhile now. It's pretty much the Phobia Cure. Steve Andreas and Dilts were both in on it getting it presented to the medical community so people can get help now instead of staying in "therapy" for years.

It has "things" unexplained as to why you are holding the client's hand, etc. but the steps are right. I'm including it in my coursework, immediately following the Phobia Cure.

Do we have a place here for posting to just professionals and not the general public? If we do, I'll put it up.

Stay well,
Marjorie

Hi judy,if the answer to the ptsd issue is more important than the modality used
look up gary craig at EFT Provides Impressive Health and Emotional Freedom--New Discovery Often Works Where Nothing Else i know it's not nlp but they have a lot
of success with ptsd it's a simple approach and it dose work

hope this helps... anon e mouse

Hi Judy,

PTSD is a collection of symptoms. The use of the trauma cure ASSUMES an anchored response. Others here are likely to disagree with me, but IMO reliance on the trauma cure to undo trauma is unrealistic (usually those who haven't had other training or life experience make this mistake).

This is especially true when NLP is used for rape/incest/ victims & battered women.

KEY POINTS TO REMEMBER:

- don't match the event(s) to the intervention. A common mistake in NLP. Instead match what they are doing in there brain (actually you probably know that!)
- don't assume that 3 x trauma cure will fix all - if she has been properly diagnosed IT WON'T!!
- a process will help her redefine her identity would be good
- biochemical support (psychiatric meds or nutracuticals)will help especially if cognitive function is disrupted
- strategic planning of other responses that will work when he comes around would be useful, but if this isn't your normal area then this is probably better coming from either a social worker or psychologist so make some referals

Everyone is welcome to their own opinions, of course, but please don't tell us what we do doesn't work. Oh yeah! Just where I would send a client -- to a psychologist -- so my client can be a cash cow for years talking about it and reliving it in every minute detail for years on end. The NLP PTSD Cure is amazing and easy to use if the steps are followed. I work with rape victims, etc. for FREE too. Think a moment please. A memory has no charge if the feelings are removed from the memory. That memory ceases to have any importance at all. FACT: it would be good to remember that Freud thought of something long term for the rich as he failed at hypnosis and thusly psychology was born.

I'm not saying that it doesn't help. My observation is that assumptions have been made that it removes all symptoms of rape and this is not (always) the case.

Here's a guideline for working with adult sexual trauma I wrote some time ago that may be useful: Rape, Sexual Trauma, NLP, Hypnosis, Hypnotherapy, Counselling in Chichester, West Sussex, UK

Regards,

Andrew T. Austin
Chichester, West Sussex, UK
Core Transformation Training, with Andrew T. Austin - Chichester, London, Wales, Newcastle

Hi Andy, thanks for that article it is very useful. For those in the UK it is also worthwhile contacting Rape Crisis as they run day courses on such things as dispelling the myths surrounding sexual assaults etc. Having information to offer the client is incredibly valuable, at least I find it so :-)

Happy New Year

Penny

Nice response Majorie,
Everyone is welcome to their own opinions, of course, but please don't tell us what we do doesn't work. Oh yeah! Just where I would send a client -- to a psychologist -- so my client can be a cash cow for years talking about it and reliving it in every minute detail for years on end. The NLP PTSD Cure is amazing and easy to use if the steps are followed. I work with rape victims, etc. for FREE too.

However:
Think a moment please. A memory has no charge if the feelings are removed from the memory. That memory ceases to have any importance at all. FACT: it would be good to remember that Freud thought of something long term for the rich as he failed at hypnosis and thusly psychology was born.

I disagree, it could also be said that you have dealt at a symptom level, the traumas still exists, the system has expressed its self with the symptoms you have dealt with. The system will try to express its again, either the symptoms return at a later date. How much research has been done into the long term results/effects of NLP?. Or the client exhibits other symptoms, so they end up coming back to you or going to some other form of intervention.
As you said Freud went from hypnosis to psychology, NLP was followed by DHE…..is there another step?
I do use NLP and have had great success in phobias cures for instance, time taken about 60 seconds. But I realise that it is a short-term emotional fix, often not long term, but effective in the presenting situation.


Time doesn’t heal…….resolution does.

I've been working with ex combat troops with PTSD. The work has been fascinating, and sometimes I've had to deal with trauma by proxy - in other words, combatants dealing with their own experiences of combat, yet have taken on the guilt and nightmares from other's experiences or news programmes. Eg - I had one ex combatant who literally lost 17 years of his life to prescribed medication. He finally got his act together and pulled himself out of this living hell, only to watch a news programme that showed the corpses of dead Iraqi children and women - he then started having vivid nightmares of being the perpetrator of these acts.

You may also be interested to know that Dr John Grinder's earlier work was done with former US troops suffering from PTSD - with great effect!

Linda

I feel that PTSD is a big label covering loads of different things, different people suffer from it in different ways.
I have treated a couple of clients diagnosed with this literally using phobia cures with huge success.
I found that what reoccurred was a trigger that caused the flashbacks, one was when they heard sirens...
Using the run the film backwards, to funny music was very impactive ...
You really dont know what will work though until you find out how they are doing it, one thing i always hold tight is that i never meet someone with the cure as that means i am assuming how they are creating the issue, i always wait till i am with them and see and hear how they create their magical monsters before i choose which tool will fit the job.

HI Michelle,
Something i learnt a while ago ,often the presenting issue is not the real one. The presenting issue is the symptom not the cause.

John

Very true John, i totally agree with you :-)

John, I've found that the 'presenting' one is the most effective 'introduction' to getting to the root of the problem/s. That's the one that the client is 'used to', so if you can make a difference there - the rest seems to just follow naturally. This is where NLP and hypnotherapy is so very very effective! Particularly with ex combatants who have been trained to think quickly and react with speed. NLP can give that speedy result initially which is understood and appreciated by these war trained minds. Psychology and psychiatry isn't (IMO) as effective because of the length of treatment, and all too frequently the client discontinues treatment for that reason - believing its doing no good! The other aspect is - NLP under these conditions have proven effective results, as demonstrated by Dr Ginder with Vietnam veterans 'a couple of wars ago'.

One thing I do advise strongly to anyone who wants to work with war veterans - getting 'through' to them is the hardest part! They are generally suspicious of 'outside' civilians and it may take a while to develop their confidence sufficiently to be able to proceed with any kind of treatment.

Linda

Yes. I think some level of trust must be present to work with folks who tend to be suspicious of outsiders. And when I use the word trust I mean something beyond "standard" rapport.

Venus

They are 2 symbiotic.
The presenting issue is what the client is familiar with, so it is 'the most effective 'introduction' to getting to the root of the problem'. It may be the only way. Long hours on a couch just cloud this making it more difficult to find the gateway to the real cause.
And if you don't have trust then the client is more likely to stay with the familiar, presenting issue, get tied up in the projection between facilitator and client and go nowhere. Usually resulting in frustration and negligible results.
The first thing I work on is trust, but I do say I might do or say some pretty strange things…………………………

John

John,

There is certainly nothing wrong with being different -- especially if that is really who you are. After all, if you're doing the same old thing as everyone else, then you're bound to get the same old results as everyone else. And that doesn't take you anywhere.

I work at a university and every day when I go to the locker room before I work out I see a sign a coach has posted on his door.

"If you want to accomplish something you've never achieved before, you need to do things you've never done before."

Sometimes the unfamiliar can be confusing, but then that's often a good place to start to learn something new.

And sometimes when folks have a limited understanding of their own experience they have an impoverished vocabulary to represent what they are experiencing to themselves and others.

For instance, they might say they are depressed when what they really are is angry.

Or nervous when they're actually excited.

That sort of thing.

Venus

P.S. What do you mean when you say "They are 2 symbiotic"?

'the unfamiliar can be confusing' and usually uncomfortable. It is also the best place to resolve issues or learn.
'For instance, they might say they are depressed when what they really are is angry.' The presenting issue, ‘depression’ will be why the client comes to see you. Now if you use NLP to work on the depression you may have an effect, it may last a long time, is it effective for the clients system? By exploring the client’s map you may come up with the anger, and again deal with it, is that effective for the clients system?
I'd be more interested in why the ‘depression’ or ‘anger’, which is how I would define the real issue. More than likely the client will not consciously know this, which is why it’s not the presenting issue. The mind protects the body anyway it can and if by ‘dissociating’ from the event this achieves that, then it will not be consciously remembered. So we are confronted with a presenting issue with no connection or knowledge of the real issue. How many people smoke because their bodies (not their minds) say ‘oh yes goodie goodie lets have a smoke’?
The hardest part for students and myself in NLP courses is the well-formed outcome. It’s easy to do a stop smoking cure and in the right environment I do a 60 second phobia cure. The real understanding IMHO is the well-formed outcome, from where I can do effective intervention.
So to find the well-formed outcome and real issue depends on the ability of the facilitiator.

‘impoverished vocabulary to represent what they are experiencing to themselves and others’ – a statement that really resounded with me. This is how we communicate all the time, so I will always advise a client that I don’t need to hear (all) the content. My work is based in Metaphor therapy so they don’t even have to describe something for me to understand. The responses can be noises, movement, gestures, or silence, drawing, words etc. When the client is free from trying to explain there is a change in the relationship with them their challenges and the facilitator.

John,

I use a modified 'Fast Phobia Cure' for PTSD symptoms at least once a week with clients in a medical setting. I'd say it works at least 90% of the time.
One difficulty with long-standing PTSD (like Viet Vets) is that they often have so much experience repeating the traumatic memories that the memories are 'burned' in many areas of the brain. As well, too much time on mind-altering drugs can make any change a challenge.
With rape and domestic violence issues the PTSD is often undiagnosed and untreated and responds quickly to the FPC.
Greg